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	<title>Comments on: More Sex Angst Roundup</title>
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	<link>http://debbienathan.com/2007/11/more-sex-angst-round-up/</link>
	<description>Sex pol, borders, Mexico, Yiddish, my camera</description>
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		<title>By: Mike</title>
		<link>http://debbienathan.com/2007/11/more-sex-angst-round-up/comment-page-1/#comment-2645</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Dec 2007 19:50:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://debbienathan.com/2007/11/29/more-sex-angst-round-up/#comment-2645</guid>
		<description>debbie, your use of graphics is terrific!  They run like a chorus along your prose -- and sometimes take the main stage, particularly when the subject matter is the emotional impact of images.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>debbie, your use of graphics is terrific!  They run like a chorus along your prose &#8212; and sometimes take the main stage, particularly when the subject matter is the emotional impact of images.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://debbienathan.com/2007/11/more-sex-angst-round-up/comment-page-1/#comment-2640</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Dec 2007 09:21:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://debbienathan.com/2007/11/29/more-sex-angst-round-up/#comment-2640</guid>
		<description>I hope the study from the University of Virginia, which finds that early consensual sexual behavior among young people, when followed along safe and intelligent guidelines, will prevent later delinquency, and will actually serve to lessen later delinquent behavior, will get an objective hearing in the U.S. Frankly, I thought any objectivity in that particular field of study was all but impossible in the current climate of fear and intimidation in the U.S.

I&#039;ve long admired the way young people are instructed in sex education in other countries. Apparently, in different countries in Europe, sex education is available for young people from elementary school, through high school. It&#039;s not treated as something that would be taboo, scary or bugaboo. They&#039;re given facts, treated intelligently, know where they can information, and behave responsibly, with very low rates of unwanted pregnancy.

Whereas in the U.S., despite years of federally-funded, obviously failed program of abstinence-only sex education, along with their mythologies about failing condoms, marriages ruined because of premarital sex, homosexuality being &quot;abnormal&quot;, etc., there are simply calls for more of the same.

God forbid we should be so humble as to question why another system actually works...

And what alternatives do gay kids have under the abstinence-only &quot;sex education&quot; program? None, really, other than to be informed that it is &quot;unnatural&quot;. That&#039;s right. I&#039;m sure that takes care of it for them.

So, when you think about it, is it really coincidental that three of the Republican nominees running for the office of the Presidency have stated they don&#039;t believe in the theory of evolution?

And the whole notion of civil commitment...continuing to serve yet more time, after one has served one&#039;s term...is simply barbaric. Basically, they are transferred from a prison, to  a hospital with bars.

Periodically, a psychologist will examine them in the facility, purportedly to check for progress of the prisoner, but since pressure is on them not to green light the release of anyone who might even, remotely, re-offend, many psychologists simply, by rote, examine everyone, and say they are not yet ready for release.

You have to wonder how someone, in such circumstances, perhaps without any finances or family, gets by, for years at a time. Are they are being mistreated, or put on some type of medication, perhaps for no real reason, and without their consent, and how could they communicate that to anyone on the outside?

It&#039;s my understanding that in some jurisdictions, all convicted sex offenders are now given civil commitment, regardless of the offense. So, potentially, someone who would slap the butt of an underage teenager (at her request) would be treated in the same manner (civil commitment after incarceration) as another person who would kidnap a three year old child from a preschool and rape her.

Of course there are seriously dangerous, and mentally ill people, who would be best served, and so would the public, by their being permanently removed and cared for. That such treatment seems to be going on routinely, these days, affecting so many people, many of whom aren&#039;t even remotely deserving of it, is simply not merely wrong, it&#039;s barbaric.

The practice has to be stopped.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hope the study from the University of Virginia, which finds that early consensual sexual behavior among young people, when followed along safe and intelligent guidelines, will prevent later delinquency, and will actually serve to lessen later delinquent behavior, will get an objective hearing in the U.S. Frankly, I thought any objectivity in that particular field of study was all but impossible in the current climate of fear and intimidation in the U.S.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve long admired the way young people are instructed in sex education in other countries. Apparently, in different countries in Europe, sex education is available for young people from elementary school, through high school. It&#8217;s not treated as something that would be taboo, scary or bugaboo. They&#8217;re given facts, treated intelligently, know where they can information, and behave responsibly, with very low rates of unwanted pregnancy.</p>
<p>Whereas in the U.S., despite years of federally-funded, obviously failed program of abstinence-only sex education, along with their mythologies about failing condoms, marriages ruined because of premarital sex, homosexuality being &#8220;abnormal&#8221;, etc., there are simply calls for more of the same.</p>
<p>God forbid we should be so humble as to question why another system actually works&#8230;</p>
<p>And what alternatives do gay kids have under the abstinence-only &#8220;sex education&#8221; program? None, really, other than to be informed that it is &#8220;unnatural&#8221;. That&#8217;s right. I&#8217;m sure that takes care of it for them.</p>
<p>So, when you think about it, is it really coincidental that three of the Republican nominees running for the office of the Presidency have stated they don&#8217;t believe in the theory of evolution?</p>
<p>And the whole notion of civil commitment&#8230;continuing to serve yet more time, after one has served one&#8217;s term&#8230;is simply barbaric. Basically, they are transferred from a prison, to  a hospital with bars.</p>
<p>Periodically, a psychologist will examine them in the facility, purportedly to check for progress of the prisoner, but since pressure is on them not to green light the release of anyone who might even, remotely, re-offend, many psychologists simply, by rote, examine everyone, and say they are not yet ready for release.</p>
<p>You have to wonder how someone, in such circumstances, perhaps without any finances or family, gets by, for years at a time. Are they are being mistreated, or put on some type of medication, perhaps for no real reason, and without their consent, and how could they communicate that to anyone on the outside?</p>
<p>It&#8217;s my understanding that in some jurisdictions, all convicted sex offenders are now given civil commitment, regardless of the offense. So, potentially, someone who would slap the butt of an underage teenager (at her request) would be treated in the same manner (civil commitment after incarceration) as another person who would kidnap a three year old child from a preschool and rape her.</p>
<p>Of course there are seriously dangerous, and mentally ill people, who would be best served, and so would the public, by their being permanently removed and cared for. That such treatment seems to be going on routinely, these days, affecting so many people, many of whom aren&#8217;t even remotely deserving of it, is simply not merely wrong, it&#8217;s barbaric.</p>
<p>The practice has to be stopped.</p>
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		<title>By: quietriot</title>
		<link>http://debbienathan.com/2007/11/more-sex-angst-round-up/comment-page-1/#comment-2644</link>
		<dc:creator>quietriot</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Dec 2007 07:43:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://debbienathan.com/2007/11/29/more-sex-angst-round-up/#comment-2644</guid>
		<description>Its impossible to believe that anyone would tell a horny teenager about abstinence and actually believe their own BS.
Would you buy a child a new toy, and then demand they leave it in the box and never play with it?
Puberty is a lot like a new toy. The kid wants to try it out and see how it works.
What could be more natural?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Its impossible to believe that anyone would tell a horny teenager about abstinence and actually believe their own BS.<br />
Would you buy a child a new toy, and then demand they leave it in the box and never play with it?<br />
Puberty is a lot like a new toy. The kid wants to try it out and see how it works.<br />
What could be more natural?</p>
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		<title>By: js</title>
		<link>http://debbienathan.com/2007/11/more-sex-angst-round-up/comment-page-1/#comment-2643</link>
		<dc:creator>js</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Dec 2007 18:16:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://debbienathan.com/2007/11/29/more-sex-angst-round-up/#comment-2643</guid>
		<description>RE: U.S. v Frabizio
Although the court denied the government&#039;s virtual experts, court documents indicate they intended to use Dr. Celeste Wilson to testify to the &quot;reality&quot; of the images.  Dr. Wilson was already on board as a Tanner Staging expert to testify to the ages of the individuals.  Notwithstanding the fact that Tanner Staging in child porn prosecutions has been proven to be junk science: http://amjur.wordpress.com/  what Rule of Evidence allowed her to offer an expert opinion on virtual v real images as a pediatrician.  Since the top dogs at CEOS were involved in the case, they were pushing for this.
(Docket numbers 168-170).

There was also an interesting interlocutory appeal by the government.  The district court ruled that 3 of the images were not admissible after being asked to review them.  The appellate court reversed, but in a concurring opinion, Judge Torruella pointed out that the majority&#039;s description of the images were inaccurate, and he adopted the district court&#039;s description.  Shows how tenuous and subjective the &quot;lascivious&quot; charge can be.
http://www.ca1.uscourts.gov/pdf.opinions/05-2034-01A.pdf   (pg.35)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>RE: U.S. v Frabizio<br />
Although the court denied the government&#8217;s virtual experts, court documents indicate they intended to use Dr. Celeste Wilson to testify to the &#8220;reality&#8221; of the images.  Dr. Wilson was already on board as a Tanner Staging expert to testify to the ages of the individuals.  Notwithstanding the fact that Tanner Staging in child porn prosecutions has been proven to be junk science: <a href="http://amjur.wordpress.com/" rel="nofollow">http://amjur.wordpress.com/</a>  what Rule of Evidence allowed her to offer an expert opinion on virtual v real images as a pediatrician.  Since the top dogs at CEOS were involved in the case, they were pushing for this.<br />
(Docket numbers 168-170).</p>
<p>There was also an interesting interlocutory appeal by the government.  The district court ruled that 3 of the images were not admissible after being asked to review them.  The appellate court reversed, but in a concurring opinion, Judge Torruella pointed out that the majority&#8217;s description of the images were inaccurate, and he adopted the district court&#8217;s description.  Shows how tenuous and subjective the &#8220;lascivious&#8221; charge can be.<br />
<a href="http://www.ca1.uscourts.gov/pdf.opinions/05-2034-01A.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.ca1.uscourts.gov/pdf.opinions/05-2034-01A.pdf</a>   (pg.35)</p>
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		<title>By: daniella</title>
		<link>http://debbienathan.com/2007/11/more-sex-angst-round-up/comment-page-1/#comment-2642</link>
		<dc:creator>daniella</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Nov 2007 03:31:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://debbienathan.com/2007/11/29/more-sex-angst-round-up/#comment-2642</guid>
		<description>intersting post! I am assuming you&#039;ve seen it but the abstinence only education stuff reminded me of the excellent documentary &quot;The Education of Shelby Knox,&quot; about an evangelical girl in Lubbock Texas who fights for sex ed in the schools.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>intersting post! I am assuming you&#8217;ve seen it but the abstinence only education stuff reminded me of the excellent documentary &#8220;The Education of Shelby Knox,&#8221; about an evangelical girl in Lubbock Texas who fights for sex ed in the schools.</p>
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		<title>By: debbie</title>
		<link>http://debbienathan.com/2007/11/more-sex-angst-round-up/comment-page-1/#comment-2641</link>
		<dc:creator>debbie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Nov 2007 15:40:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://debbienathan.com/2007/11/29/more-sex-angst-round-up/#comment-2641</guid>
		<description>FYI to readers: I am not posting comments that come in from proxy servers and/or for which I am unable to contact the writer before posting. You are welcome to send me anything you want by whatever means, preferably to my email address. All blog comments are vetted by me, so do not expect automatic publication. Thanks. DN</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>FYI to readers: I am not posting comments that come in from proxy servers and/or for which I am unable to contact the writer before posting. You are welcome to send me anything you want by whatever means, preferably to my email address. All blog comments are vetted by me, so do not expect automatic publication. Thanks. DN</p>
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